Where do we go when we die? An edited repost that is always pertinent.

 Several years ago, a brother in Christ opened his home a couple of times a month, and a few of us gathered for a home church meeting. This brother-in-Christ did the teaching/preaching and, on one Saturday night, attempted to cover the question – where do we go when we die?

He had a well-drawn graphic that showed what many call the upper level of hell and the lower level. So while he had some additional terminology, essentially what we saw, according to our teacher that night, is representative of hell.

In theory, all this conjecture about multiple layers of hell is based on the “story” about the rich man and the poor beggar Lazarus that Jesus told. (I am convinced that these were real people.) As you may

remember, Lazarus the beggar was now comforted in Abraham's bosom, while the nameless rich man was now in torment, separated by a great gulf. As the evening progressed, all we saw in the graphic were interpreted as spiritual places. I had to question that concept because the rich man was in torment, and his condition sounded very physical to me.

He opened by asking the group this question, do you believe you would be in the Lord's presence when you die?

I was unclear about what he was trying to accomplish, so I asked him if he wanted a response from the group. He replied, yes. While a few others raised their hands, I was, in those few seconds, the only one with my hand up and added because to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.
I said nothing more to clarify my statement, as almost every follower of Christ has heard this passage at some point.

“Now He who prepared us for this very purpose is God, who gave to us the Spirit as a pledge. Therefore, being always of good courage, and knowing that while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord--for we walk by faith, not by sight--we are of good courage, I say, and prefer rather to be absent from the body and to be at home with the Lord. Therefore we also have as our ambition, whether at home or absent, to be pleasing to Him.” (2 Corinthians 5:5-9 NASB)

Apparently, our leader had not heard nor read this passage before; and though he said nothing as a challenge, his utterances indicated disbelief. Several minutes later, another brother-in-Christ interjected with 2 Corinthians 5:5-9, to which the leader replied, Oh, is that in the Bible?

Allow me a quick breakdown of the passage above.

Because He gave us the Spirit (think Holy Spirit), we can have solid confidence that once we are absent from this body, we are present with the Lord. Most followers of Christ feel this all the time.

What followed was a question/statement from the group leader that went like this: 

Then, is it true that the dead know nothing and merely lay in the ground until some day of judgment? 

Again I replied, yes, both statements are true, (However, the question makes no distinction between a child of God and a non-believer, and that is a problem.) The group leader was clearly undone and would not acknowledge or look at me. I know it is not all about me, but some form of recognition that you heard what I said would be nice. (In all honesty, I was mad also. Don't get me wrong, I like the guy, but I can't stand false teaching, and I did not come back for several weeks. When I did come back, it was like a God thing, as a dear lady that had also spoken up at the previous meeting was there. When the leader opened the meeting this night, he abruptly said we should keep our opinions to ourselves. Whoa, you asked for input, and we, both, refuted with the Word of God. This was the last time I went to this home meeting. Not to worry about this brother, though, for Pastor gave him a group teaching slot at church; and no, I do not go to this church anymore either.)

Ecclesiastes 9:5 NLT  “The living at least know they will die, but the dead know nothing. They have no further reward, nor are they remembered.”

Since I read this passage, I have understood that the dead lie in the ground, in some form of sleep, until they are awakened and brought before the great white for final judgment. (Note. If you are in the Lord and die, where are you? The answer lies in 2 Corinthians 5:8, where the believers are immediately present with the Lord.)

Something doesn't make sense, for there are stories of people that have died and spent time in hell, and they describe it as pure torment. If the dead lie there quietly, then how do these people get taken into hell? This gives me grief as, in my understanding, NO ONE is in hell nor goes there until the final judgment at the great white throne at the end of the thousand years.

(Just a touch of clarification. When Jesus physically comes back to earth, one of the first things He does is to grab the antichrist and the false prophet and throw them alive into the lake of fire. These two are the only ones sent to eternal punishment until after the great white throne).

Let me show you what I might use to substantiate what I understand about the dead. Most people seem to struggle because they see these from the nations and assume they are alive. Remember that death is a relative term, as all of us have eternal spirits, and we never really die.

Matthew 25:31-34 NASB "But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. (32) "All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats; (33) and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left. (34) "Then the King will say to those on His right, 'Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.”

Alright, then, how do we understand this?

First, this is the same scenario that we see in Revelation 20.

“Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat upon it, from whose presence earth and heaven fled away, and no place was found for them. (12) And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds. (13) And the sea gave up the dead which was in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead which was in them; and they were judged, every one of them according to their deeds.”
Revelation 20:11-13 NASB

For comparison, I give you Matthew's account.

“When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:” Matthew 25:31 KJV 

Secondly, pay attention to the thrones.

• In Matthew, it is His glorious throne, and in Revelation 20, it is a great white throne.

  Why should we see any distinction between great and glorious?

  Great is the Greek word mégas. It is an adjective describing size, such as: Great, large, particularly of physical magnitude.

  Throne thrónos - A seat, usually high and having a footstool, a throne as the emblem of royal authority.

  Glory/glorious is the Gk word dóxa. It is a noun and means to think (about) or recognize (His) Glory.

  In both the throne of Revelation 20 and Matthew 25, the throne is to be seen as an emblem of royal authority. Matthew's account also shows Jesus coming in a manner in which those witnessing His "entrance" recognize His glory.

• In the Revelation account, we only perceive those before the throne to be dead, while Matthew's rendition presents them as alive.

  Death, it would seem, is a relative term since our spirits are eternal and we never die. Therefore, all these people may be spirits. (Since we are reattached to improved versions of our bodies, then maybe God will do the same with these “dead” so that they can fully understand the agonizing discomfort of hell if that is where they will go.)

  On the cross, Jesus cried out, my God, why have you forsaken me. We understand that He experienced a total and complete separation from the Father, and that is the ultimate death.

• In the Revelation account, we see the book of life; however, all we see is the result of those not being found in the book. In contrast, Matthew's account shows us no books in the event, yet many receive mercy. 

Revelation 20:15 NASB “And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.”

The assumption most make as they read about the great white throne is that no one is found worthy of salvation, and all are thrown into the lake of fire, henceforth hell. But an honest inquiry into this verse will show you that Revelation 20:12 speaks of books; the implication is that God is desperately looking through those books for those to which He can show mercy. To see this any other way is nothing less than a cruel and morbid joke on God's part, for He knew whether He would find their names in those books and is, therefore, merely having fun at the expense of those standing there. Anyone who understands God's nature knows that this scenario will never happen. 

“just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him. In love.” (Ephesians 1:4 NASB)

King David, a man who sinned frequently, said,

“Your eyes have seen my unformed substance; And in Your book were all written The days that were ordained for me, When as yet there was not one of them.”
(Psalms 139:16 NASB)

He already knows what is written in those books.

Consider this. God so loved this world so much that even while they spit in His face, He gave His only Son, Jesus, so that through the horrors of death, He could redeem the world, and then they could love Him freely if they chose. 

In contrast to the Revelation account, Matthew tells us that He already knows the answer to what His eyes were searching for in those books and, therefore, separates the crowd into sheep and goats. He gives those He deems sheep entrance into the kingdom of peace.

The people in the sheep category seem puzzled, knowing that they did not measure up by religious standards, and ask, what did we do to deserve entrance into the kingdom of Heaven? 

"Then the King will say to those on His right, 'Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. (35) 'For I was hungry, and you gave Me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited Me in; (36) naked, and you clothed Me; I was sick, and you visited Me; I was in prison, and you came to Me.' (37) "Then the righteous will answer Him, 'Lord, when did we see You hungry, and feed You, or thirsty, and give You something to drink? (38) 'And when did we see You a stranger, and invite You in, or naked, and clothe You? (39) 'When did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?' (40) "The King will answer and say to them, 'Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of Mine, even the least of them, you did it to Me.” Matthew 25:34-40 NASB

What did they do that gained their entrance into the kingdom?

They acted in the nature and character of God.

So back to the problems with the graphics I started with and the multi-layered hell.

While it is clear that this was understood by the Jews during Jesus' time on earth, we have nothing beyond the resurrection (primarily Paul's writings) that would enforce a multi-layered hell. 

If Paul did not preach it, why should I?

Paul wrote about the dead in Christ in an attempt to address such misconceptions.

“For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. (17) Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord.”
1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 NASB

Paul used the word nekrós, which means a corpse, when he spoke of the dead in 1 Thessalonians. So the dead then is merely corpses' catching up with the spirit, which is already with Jesus, if you are a believer. I have thought about the whys of needing our corpses, and I suspect God could merely make another body for us if we needed it, but then, Jesus did not just leave His lying around, did He. (As a side note. The sinful nature is attached to the living body. If you think about how taking a bite out of a piece of fruit can permanently change you, then you have to be talking about genetics. We have, in the last two years, seen for ourselves, if we were paying attention, that an injection can affect our DNA. Once the DNA code is changed in one, then everything produced by that one impacts all future progeny. But it wasn't just one, and therefore, one human escaped the damage.

Well, how do you get rid of the damage?

It has to be killed, and suddenly this change (in a twinkling of an eye) that we all must go through begins to look like the death of the body. Remember,

“And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:”
(Hebrews 9:27 KJV)

And we have two known humans that, as far as we know, did not die as yet, Enoch and Elijah, but those two, standing in the streets of Jerusalem, will someday die and fulfill the requirement. This death/judgment is something only God can do, so don't try to take matters into your own hands, as that is stupid and exactly what Satan wants you to do – as it removes you from usefulness here on earth.

Now, imagine if Peter and John had returned to the tomb and found His body lying there; the entirety of the resurrection would have been undone in this scenario. And, when Jesus showed himself to the 120 in the upper room, He showed them that same physical body. It was proof of His resurrection, and it validated His previous statements.

I suspect we have more than a couple of significant players in our misconceptions about hell. 

1. Dante Alighieri and his book The Inferno.

2. The book is known to have been a method to confront what he perceived as religious: persecution, error, disagreement, and graft. Dante placed real people in various levels of his creation, each group having its own nasty punishment. Dante showed some mercy by implying that his victims could earn their way out, although none ever made it out.

3. The Catholic Church seems to have adopted the concepts within Dante's book. One of those concepts is purgatory. From what I understand, if you comply with some monetary demand, you can buy your way out. It did not happen to any of Dante's characters and has not happened here on earth.

4. The last and most damaging story is about the poor beggar Lazarus and the wealthy Jewish man. So let's pursue this for a moment.

The passage in Luke is detailed and lengthy, so I am t going to put the entire thing in here. But, suffice it to say; the rich man is still attempting to order Lazarus around, and the rich man is in torment, while Lazarus is not.

“... Now the poor man died and was carried away by the angels to Abraham's bosom; and the rich man also died and was buried. (23) "In Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and *saw Abraham far away and Lazarus in his bosom. (24) "And he cried out and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me,... (25) "But Abraham said, 'Child, remember that during your life you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus bad things; but now he is being comforted here, and you are in agony. (26) 'And besides all this, between us and you, there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and that none may cross over from there to us. ...” Luke 16:19-31 NASB

“Now the poor man died and was carried away by the angels to Abraham's bosom.”

What is the difference between the event that Jesus described and how we should perceive this today?

The resurrection.

Here, in Luke's gospel, Jesus is talking to Jews who have little to no comprehension of grace nor of the catching away of the Church. The Jews do, however, understand that the soul seems to lie in a state of waiting. In Ecclesiastes, we learn that.

Ecclesiastes 9:5 KJV  For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not anything, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.

Another source of Jewish understanding comes from King David.

Psalms 31:17 KJV  Let me not be ashamed, O LORD; for I have called upon thee: let the wicked be ashamed, and let them be silent in the grave.

Again, the general idea is that the dead lie in silence until called.

In looking at the word paradise, which comes up in the conversation between Jesus and the thief on the cross, we see Jesus saying,

"Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise." Luke 23:43b NIV

In the Jewish understanding, the word paradisos is an oriental word that the Greeks borrowed from the Persians, among whom it meant a garden, park, or enclosure full of all the vegetable products of the earth. ...The original Eastern word pardes occurs in Neh_2:8; Ecc_2:5; Son_4:13. In Sanskrit, paradésha, and paradisha meant a land elevated and cultivated. In Armenian, pardes means a garden around the house planted with grass, herbs, and trees for food and ornament. The Sept. uses it to refer to the Garden of Eden (Gen_2:8). In later Jewish usage and in the NT, parádeisos is used for the abode of the blessed after death. Paradise, before Christ's resurrection, has been thought to be the region of the blessed in Hades, although it was not specifically called by that name (Luk_16:23). [From the Word Study Dictionary]

And finally, the early church deemed paradise to be an upper level of heaven where the dead would wait.

Paradise is but an Anglicized form of the Greek word παράδεισος. It does not occur in the Old Testament, in the English version, but is used in the Septuagint to translate the Hebrew gân, גָּן, a garden (Gen_2:8 sq.), and thence found its way into the New Testament, where it is applied figuratively to the celestial dwelling of the righteous, in allusion to the Garden of Eden (2Co_12:4; Rev_2:7). It has thus come into familiar use to denote both that garden and the heaven of the just. Cyclopedia of Biblical, Theological, and Ecclesiastical Literature

It does not matter how eloquently you deliver the evidence that backs your thesis or arguments against some false or skewed teaching; someone will have a comeback. The mere fact that the rich man was in torment, and there is the possibility that he could see the beggar Lazarus in Abraham's bosom, only fuels their fire. This is, again, one of those places where looking up the simplest of words, such as “saw,” where you can gain some additional understanding.

“and the rich man also died and was buried. (23) "In Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torment,”

Torment is the Greek word basanos and also means torture. The NASB tells us that he saw Lazarus. The word saw is the Greek word horaō and means to stare at (by implication) to discern clearly (physically or mentally.)

So, none of us can prove that the man could even see Lazarus, and therefore it would be just as easy to assume that the rich man was allowed to discern mentally that Abraham now held Lazarus peacefully and securely. If there is a point to this, it is this, refrain from preaching and teaching things you do not have an accurate understanding about unless you are willing to humble yourself and tell the people that you really don't know, that this is your opinion and that they should search the scriptures to gain a clearer picture.

We were also told by this brother-in-Christ, that led the home group, that he did not have a complete confidence in his relationship with Jesus Christ and would not until that day when we are called home. This is not what Paul and others taught. Jesus and this Word give us every confidence to know that we are loved, and wanted, and since we have accepted Jesus Christ as our sacrifice, then we can know that we, NO MATTER WHAT, have a home with Him in glory.

You cannot lose your salvation because you are sealed. 2 Corinthians 1:21-22.

 Contrary to the religion I grew up in, many have been talking about NOT being able to lose your salvation. The context of this conversation should be obvious, what do you believe, and does it line up with the Word of God? 

If your beliefs, no matter where they came from, such as the faith movement, do not line up with the Word of God, dump them! While the terminology may not be precise, the idea that we are eternally saved is found in multiple locations throughout the Bible. Here is one of those places.

2 Corinthians 1:21-22 NASB (21) Now He who establishes us with you in Christ and anointed us is God, (22) who also sealed us and gave us the Spirit in our hearts as a pledge.

Here, Paul is doing the talking, and he is referring to a "He", who establishes us, ("us" here has to be referring to those with Paul and the early church body in Corinth.)

To Establish is to confirm, render constant, strengthen, make firm, ratify, or establish by arguments or proofs.

Paul goes on to say, that this "He," has anointed the believers, the church body.

Anointed, according to the Word Study Dictionary, tells us that "Anointing had the significance of dedication to God;" "Priests were set apart by anointing;" "Kings were designated by anointing, and we see this with David and Saul;" and, "This act was accompanied by the gift of the Spirit. So when David was anointed, the Spirit descended on him and departed from Saul."

Jumping forward to 2 Corinthians 5, we get this.

2 Corinthians 5:1-6 NASB (1) For we know that if the earthly tent which is our house is torn down, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. (2) For indeed in this house we groan, longing to be clothed with our dwelling from heaven, (3) inasmuch as we, having put it on, will not be found naked. (4) For indeed while we are in this tent, we groan, being burdened because we do not want to be unclothed but to be clothed, so that what is mortal will be swallowed up by life. (5) Now He who prepared us for this very purpose is God, who gave to us the Spirit as a pledge. (6) Therefore, being always of good courage, and knowing that while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord--

The bottom line is that this "He" is God. Never forget that God, the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit, is one. But pay attention to the fact that God gave us the Spirit as a pledge.

But a pledge of what?

The context of this secondary conversation shows you a conversation about how we long to be clothed with our dwelling from heaven. Notice verse four as it says, while dwelling in these mortal bodies we feel unclothed and long to be clothed with our dwelling from heaven; while we feel unclothed, we can KNOW that these mortal bodies will eventually, be swallowed up by life - God is life. And finally, God, gave us the Holy Spirit as a pledge. 

For those who fear as Christians, not knowing where their home is, I give you verse six.

"Therefore, being always of good courage, and knowing that while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord--"

Come back to 2 Corinthians 1:22 for a moment.

2 Corinthians 1:22 NASB (22) who also sealed us and gave us the Spirit in our hearts as a pledge.

Sealed is the Greek word sphragizo which means to seal, or stamp with a seal for the purpose of finalizing or to close up a transaction.

According to the Word Study Dictionary sealed also implies:

• to mark distinctively as invested with a certain character, John 6:27;

  Whose character are we talking about, Paul's? Not hardly; we are talking about God's character.

• to set one’s own mark upon, to seal as one’s own, a mark of acceptance, 2Corinthians 1:22;

  God has accepted us, sealed us, and marked us as His own.

• to deliver over safely to someone, Romans 15:28;

  And it is the Holy Spirit that will deliver us over, safely to the Father; this is a logical action considering that He paid for us.

Jesus made the final payment on our behalf and God closed the books, indicating ownership when we accepted that Jesus died and rose again for us. At this point, God sealed us, and He did it with the Holy Spirit. 

The Holy Spirit is that mark upon our lives.

And note how 2 Corinthians 1:22 tells us that the Holy Spirit is in our hearts as a mark of God's pledge.

When did that happen?

On the day you accepted Him.

• Romans 16:25 says that you were established according to Paul's gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ.

• 1 Peter 5:10 tells us that He is always working to perfect, confirm, strengthen and establish you.

• King David, in Psalm 37:23-24, states that we won't be hurled headlong because the LORD is the One who holds your hand.

• Psalms 89:4 says, that He will establish your seed forever.

• And in Isaiah 9:7 We are told that it is the zeal of the LORD of hosts which will accomplish this in us.

How do you come to Jesus?

1 Corinthians 15:1-4 NASB (1) Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand, (2) by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you unless you believed in vain. (3) For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, (4) and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures,

That Gospel is simply this. Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures. He was buried, dead, and raised again, to life, on the third day by the Father. Romans 1:16-17 tells us that this gospel is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. And that we continue to live in this salvation through faith.

Perhaps this might help.

Jesus, I admit that I am broken and I need a savior. I understand that you died for me so that I could live eternally, with the Father, in heaven. I have nothing to offer you but my life and so I give that to you now. Thank you for forgiving my sins and accepting me into your kingdom.

Christ the Hope of Jews and Gentiles, Romans 15: 8-13.

Christ the Hope of Jews and Gentiles

When we closed our last post, we were counseled to welcome others, just as the Messiah has welcomed us. God nor Paul have changed their minds, and so we continue with Romans chapter 15, starting at verse 8.

Romans 15:8 CJB  For I say that the Messiah became a servant of the Jewish people in order to show God's truthfulness by making good his promises to the Patriarchs,

I appreciate how the CJB centers our focus on the Jewishness of Paul's letter when it says, the Messiah became a servant of the Jewish people. “The Messiah” is, of course, talking about Jesus, as we of non-Jewish understanding call him.

The Messiah came in order to do what?

• To show God's truthfulness (CJB).

The CEV translation tells us “that Christ came as a servant of the Jews to show that God has kept the promises he made.”

The ERV states that “Christ became a servant of the Jews to show that God has done what he promised.”

The NLT translation conveys: “that Christ came as a servant to the Jews to show that God is true to the promises he made to their ancestors.”

Confirm is the Greek word bebaioō and means to make firm, establish, confirm, or make sure.
What the translators have defined as promises is the Greek word epaggeliaand according to Strong's dictionary means an announcement (for information, assent or pledge; especially a divine assurance of good). According to Thayer's, it means a promise, the act of promising, or a promise given.

The LORD has announced his victory and has revealed his righteousness to every nation! He has remembered his promise to love and be faithful to Israel. The ends of the earth have seen the victory of our God. (Psalms 98:2-3 NLT)

To whom is God showing this faithfulness?
This question I asked above evokes another question in me. 

Is God still showing His faithfulness when He brings promised wrath against His people for disobedience?
You bet He is. The UCRT says this:

“Though the Canaanites were expelled for their wickedness, it does not follow, that the Israelites were established in their room on account of any distinguished virtue, or because they deserved it. On many occasions, it may be seen in the history of the world, that God punishes the wicked by the instrumentality of other men, who are as wicked as themselves.” [The Ultimate Cross-Reference Treasury is based upon The New Treasury of Scripture Knowledge Copyright © 1992 by Jerome H. Smith and Nelson's Cross Reference Guide to the Bible © 2007 by Jerome H. Smith]
The general answer to the question, to who is God showing this faithfulness, or to whom did He show this faithfulness. The answer is spelled out in the verse itself and bulleted below.

• • To the patriarchs (the early fathers of the faith.)

Who is Paul referring to when he speaks of the patriarchs?
Deuteronomy 9:5 spells them out distinctly.

"It is not for your righteousness or for the uprightness of your heart that you are going to possess their land, but it is because of the wickedness of these nations that the LORD your God is driving them out before you, in order to confirm the oath which the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. (Deuteronomy 9:5 NASB)

Peter validated what we see in Deuteronomy.

Peter saw his opportunity and addressed the crowd. “People of Israel,” he said, “what is so surprising about this? And why stare at us as though we had made this man walk by our own power or godliness? For it is the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob—the God of all our ancestors—who has brought glory to his servant Jesus by doing this. This is the same Jesus whom you handed over and rejected before Pilate, despite Pilate’s decision to release him. (Acts 3:12-13 NLT)

And Stephen, in presenting his defense to the Jewish council, also told us who the fathers were.

‘I am the God of your ancestors—the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.’ Moses shook with terror and did not dare to look. (Acts 7:32 NLT)

While the descendants do not qualify as founding fathers, the benefit given to the Fathers extends to their descendants as well.

“I will confirm my covenant with you and your descendants after you, from generation to generation. This is the everlasting covenant: I will always be your God and the God of your descendants after you. (Genesis 17:7 NLT)

Could the Holy Spirit be referencing others besides these patriarchs, as well?
Let's say no, because He is making a point, and, as I indicated from Deuteronomy, there are three names that the Jewish community immediately brings to mind. Now, that doesn't prevent names like Elijah, Samuel, King David, and King Solomon from coming to mind, so perhaps there is an allusion to others. The Old Testament is filled with tales of people, who stepped out of their comfort zone and turned defeat into victory.

The following is from the Albert Barnes commentary.

Referencing Acts 3:25, Barnes states: “Ye are the children of the prophets - Greek: “Ye are the sons of the prophets.” The meaning is, not that they were literally the “descendants” of the prophets, but that they were their “disciples,” “pupils,” “followers.” They professed to follow the prophets as their teachers and guides. Teachers among the Jews were often spoken of under the appellation of fathers, and disciples as sons, Mat_12:27.”

However, we, the Gentiles who have been grafted in, get to be partakers in these promises.

• • And, as we will see, the Gentiles/Nations.

We talked about the nations, in detail, when we covered Romans 11. Here is a little example.

But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive, were grafted in among them and became partaker with them of the rich root of the olive tree,
(Romans 11:17 NASB)

We, from among the nations, are grafted in when we accept Jesus as the Messiah.

• • By making good his promises to the Patriarchs.

At the time of Paul's writing, had God, at least to some degree, done this already? Without a doubt, and yet He was nowhere close to done. Well over 2000 years later, there is no doubt that the descendants of Abraham are like the sands of the seashore.

But what promises did God make?
In our example to Abraham, we see this:

I will make you extremely fruitful. Your descendants will become many nations, and kings will be among them! “I will confirm my covenant with you and your descendants after you, from generation to generation. This is the everlasting covenant: I will always be your God and the God of your descendants after you. And I will give the entire land of Canaan, where you now live as a foreigner, to you and your descendants. It will be their possession forever, and I will be their God.” (Genesis 17:6-8 NLT)

The Abrahamic covenant was confirmed in Isaac.

Now there was a famine in the land, besides the previous famine that had occurred in the days of Abraham. So Isaac went to Gerar, to Abimelech king of the Philistines. The LORD appeared to him and said, "Do not go down to Egypt; stay in the land of which I shall tell you. "Sojourn in this land and I will be with you and bless you, for to you and to your descendants I will give all these lands, and I will establish the oath which I swore to your father, Abraham. "I will multiply your descendants as the stars of heaven, and will give your descendants all these lands; and by your descendants, all the nations of the earth shall be blessed; because Abraham obeyed Me and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws." (Genesis 26:1-5 NASB)

With Jacob, we see this.

Then Jacob departed from Beersheba and went toward Haran. He came to a certain place and spent the night there because the sun had set, and he took one of the stones of the place and put it under his head and lay down in that place. He had a dream, and behold, a ladder was set on the earth with its top reaching to heaven; and behold, the angels of God were ascending and descending on it. And behold, the LORD stood above it and said, "I am the LORD, the God of your father Abraham and the God of Isaac; the land on which you lie, I will give it to you and to your descendants. "Your descendants will also be like the dust of the earth, and you will spread out to the west and to the east and to the north and to the south; and in you and in your descendants shall all the families of the earth be blessed. "Behold, I am with you and will keep you wherever you go and will bring you back to this land; for I will not leave you until I have done what I have promised you." (Genesis 28:10-15 NASB)

So if I ask to whom else are these promises given, just look at verse 9.

Romans 15:9-11 AMP And [also in order] that the Gentiles (nations) might glorify God for His mercy [not covenanted] to them. As it is written, Therefore I will praise You among the Gentiles and sing praises to Your name. [Ps. 18:49.] (10) Again it is said, Rejoice (exult), O Gentiles, along with His [own] people; [Deut. 32:43.] (11) And again, Praise the Lord, all you Gentiles, and let all the peoples praise Him! [Ps. 117:1.]

And the Gentiles will give glory to God for His mercy.
Doesn't that mean we, the Gentiles, would learn of His mercies somehow?
Of course, it does, and that is why some of us study the Bible.

This is why:

• Paul was taken into custody,
• Peter preached to the Centurion,
• Saul attacked the church so violently in its early stages and drove them to the outer reaches, all the while preaching this good news of Jesus the Messiah.

Romans 15:12 AMP And further Isaiah says, There shall be a Sprout from the Root of Jesse, He Who rises to rule over the Gentiles; in Him shall the Gentiles hope. [Isa. 11:1, 10; Rev. 5:5; 22:16.]

What exactly does Isaiah say?

Like a branch that sprouts from a stump, someone from David's family will someday be king. The Spirit of the LORD will be with him to give him understanding, wisdom, and insight. He will be powerful, and he will know and honor the LORD. His greatest joy will be to obey the LORD. This king won't judge by appearances or listen to rumors. The poor and the needy will be treated with fairness and with justice. His word will be law everywhere in the land, and criminals will be put to death. Honesty and fairness will be his royal robes. (Isaiah 11:1-5 CEV)

And Paul closes out this section with his own blessing.

Romans 15:13 NASB Now may the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so that you will abound in hope by the power of the Holy Spirit.

To use the word may is to include it as a variable. If it is a variable, then what are the parameters upon which this God of Hope fills you all joy and peace?
For example, I struggle with peace, in the sense that I don't always handle external inputs well, this includes screaming grandkids and loud televisions. By the way, all the inputs seem to be external.

While many of the translations read like the NASB above, or the NIV below,
May the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace as you trust in him, so that you may overflow with hope by the power of the Holy Spirit.

Several come across in this manner.

(NLT)  I pray that God, the source of hope, will fill you completely with joy and peace because you trust in him. Then you will overflow with confident hope through the power of the Holy Spirit.

Here, in the NLT translation, I get an honest sense of Paul, when he says, I pray that God, the source of hope, will fill you completely; this is the type of language that we often hear Paul use. One example comes from his letter to the church in Ephesus.

do not cease giving thanks for you, while making mention of you in my prayers; that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give to you a spirit of wisdom and of revelation in the knowledge of Him. I pray that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened so that you will know what is the hope of His calling, what are the riches of the glory of His inheritance in the saints, and what is the surpassing greatness of His power toward us who believe. These are in accordance with the working of the strength of His might. (Ephesians 1:16-19 NASB)

Hope is the Greek word elpis and means an expectation of good, or to anticipate, usually with pleasure.

So a rewrite of verse 13 could sound like this:
May the God of expectation fill you …. Expectation is a part of who we are.

The phrase “with all” is the Greek word pas and means all, any, every, the whole.

Joy is the Greek word chara and means cheerfulness, and calm delight.

The phrase “by the power of the Holy Spirit” is the Greek word pisteuō and means to believe, or have faith in.

So Paul has prayed that we May (have) the God of expectation fill (us in) any, every, and all cheerfulness and calm delight, as we (empowered by the Holy Spirit) believe or have faith (in God to come through with His promises to us.)

We are now officially living in conditions that most of us in America, had never experienced (although my parents lived through the depression).


Now is the time for prayers like what we see in verse 15, to be a part of our expectation and thinking. God has a plan and He will deliver.